Indian students rank near the bottom on PISA, a global test of learning standards conducted in 74 nations this year. TIMSS, another standardized international test, produced similar results earlier in 2003.
This is the first time that Indian students participated in PISA. Students from Himachal Pradesh and Tamil Nadu took the Program for International Student Assessment (PISA) test, coordinated by the Paris-based Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD). Prior to this participation, students from Indian states of Orissa and Rajasthan took a similar test called Trends in International Mathematics and Science Study (TIMSS) in 2003.
Tamil Nadu and Himachal Pradesh rank high on human development indicators among Indian states. The India Human Development Report 2011, prepared by the Institute of Applied Manpower Research (IAMR), categorized them as “median” states, putting them significantly ahead of the national average. IAMR is an autonomous arm of India's Planning Commission.
Himachal Pradesh ranked 4 and Tamil Nadu 11 in literacy rates on India's National Family Health Survey released in 2007. However, in the PISA study, Tamil Nadu ranked 72 and Himachal Pradesh 73, just ahead of the bottom-ranked Kyrgyzstan in mathematics and overall reading skills. Shanghai, China's biggest city, topped the PISA rankings in all three categories—overall reading skills, mathematical and scientific literacy. The new entrants included Costa Rica, Georgia, India (Himachal Pradesh & Tamil Nadu), Malaysia, Malta, Mauritius, Venezuela (Miranda), Moldova, United Arab Emirates. PISA 2009+ involved testing just over 46 000 students across these ten economies, representing a total of about 1,377,000 15-year-olds.
In Tamil Nadu, only 17% of students were estimated to possess proficiency in reading that is at or above the baseline needed to be effective and productive in life. In Himachal Pradesh, this level is 11%. “This compares to 81% of students performing at or above the baseline level in reading in the OECD countries, on an average,” said the study.
The average Indian child taking part in PISA2009+ is 40 to 50 points behind the worst students in the economic superstars. Even the best performers in Tamil Nadu and Himachal Pradesh - the top 5 percent who India will need in science and technology to complete globally - were almost 100 points behind the average child in Singapore and 83 points behind the average Korean - and a staggering 250 points behind the best in the best.
The average child in HP & TN is right at the level of the worst OECD or American students (only 1.5 or 7.5 points ahead). Contrary to President Obama's oft-expressed concerns about American students ability to compete with their Indian counterparts, the average 15-year-old Indian placed in an American school would be among the weakest students in the classroom, says Lant Pritchett of Harvard University. Even the best TN/HP students are 24 points behind the average American 15 year old.
The 2003 TIMSS study ranked India at 46 among 51 countries. Indian students' score was 392 versus average of 467 for the group. These results were contained in a Harvard University report titled "India Shining and Bharat Drowning".
These results are not only a wake-up call for the "India Shining" brigade, but also raise serious questions about the credibility of India's western cheerleaders like Indian-American journalist Fareed Zakaria and New York Times' columnist Tom Friedman.
Related Links:
Haq's Musings
India Shining, Bharat Drowning
Pasi Sahlberg on why Finland leads the world in education
CNN's Fixing Education in America-Fareed Zakaria
PISA's Scores 2011
Poor Quality of Education in South Asia
Infections Cause Low IQs in South Asia, Africa?
Peepli Live Destroys Western Myths About India
PISA 2009Plus Results Report
Threre are more reasons to migrate to Canada
1 year ago
42 comments:
Riaz,
AOA. How come Pakistan is not taking part in these international assessments?
Haseeb: "How come Pakistan is not taking part in these international assessments?"
Good question.
I don't know why. But I do think it's something Pakistani education establishment should consider. There was an effort in that direction in 2005 when ACER's (Australian Council for Education Research) International Institute worked with Melbourne University to deliver training to a group of 14 senior education administrators from Pakistan. The training took place over three weeks and ACER staff presented a program on monitoring and evaluation in secondary science for the group from the provinces of the Punjab, Balochistan and North West Frontier Province.
I am glad to see you going after Farid and Thomas....
I like your writings and efforts to bring up good information but this is another example of putting down India.
Please tell me what is gained by such derogatory statements and how it helps (1). a more positive image of Pakistan, and (2). the chances of better understanding and peace between the two countries.
If I was from India, I would be offended and retaliate with harsh words, just as I would be offended by similar writing to put down Pakistan.
Amjad: "I like your writings and efforts to bring up good information but this is another example of putting down India."
There's nothing derogatory in my post.
It's based on facts with credible sources cited, and my candid opinion as a blogger. I offer similar commentary on the results of dysfunction in Pakistan.
There can be no improvement without facing the realities of poverty of education and lack of human development in South Asia.
"AOA. How come Pakistan is not taking part in these international assessments?"
For what? Only to prove that Pak education is non existent.
Ask yourself? How come Pakistan has no name in knowledge based economy unlike India. It is not as if it is below the dignity of Pakistanis to work in IT, medical, back office sectors. Given that their rupee is 50% worse than Indian rupees, it would have been a win-win situation for both Pak and west. Did it ever happen? NOT.
Why?
Riaz has posted this to annoy Indians who I am sure must be bombarding him with insulting messages. And this is where he is wrong. No one in the west looks for result of such tests before deciding to outsource. No one in west looks at these tests before hiring an Indian. the recent fair act for change in Greencard is directed towards Indians and Chinese so that more of them can get GC. Does that tell something about US govt preferring Indians/Chinese over others. I am happy for this low class education.
Riaz: Far from being annoyed, I actually enjoy this because how much you are envious of India's success is visible in this post. If you think this would help Pakistan even .001%, then Insha Allah.
Mukund: "For what? Only to prove that Pak education is non existent."
It's just pure angry speculation on your part because Pakistani students did not take the test and we don't know for sure how they'd do.
Given the similarities between Indian and Pakistani education systems, it's quite probable that Pakistanis would fare as poorly as their Indian counterparts if they took PISA and TIMSS.
In any event, knowing what I know I'd say Pakistanis have a lot of work to do to be competitive in terms of the quality of education.
What is clear from the PISA results is that the Chinese students topped the list of 74 nations and Indian students ended up second to last at #73.
So the Indians comparing themselves with China and the whole BRIC thing is just ludicrous. The only thing common between India and China is the size of the population.
Even the whole BRIC hype about India is fading with Goldman Sachs' Jim O'Neill expressing disappointment with India.
Whys is India not a scientific power, asks an Op Ed in The Hindu:
.....It is the robustness of scientific research and innovation that sets apart great powers from the mediocre ones.
We have good scientists, but why has India not produced outstanding scientists who make path-breaking discoveries that will make the world sit up and take notice? Should we continue to be satisfied with tweaking borrowed technologies? Is reverse engineering an innovative phenomenon?
All debates about scientific research inevitably end up zeroing in on the deficiencies of our educational system as the root cause of the abysmal record in scientific research. This is only part of the story.
A nation's culture — belief systems, values, attitudes — plays a significant role in determining the quality of scientific research. The Oriental attitudes differ from the Occidental values in many respects. Asian societies are basically collectivist, that is, the collective good of society ranks higher than individual happiness and achievements. People do not ask what they can do for their country; they are always asking what the country will do for them. They look up to the state for guidance, leadership and direction. There is no burning individual ambition to excel and achieve something new.
In the West, individuals try to achieve their potential through their own efforts, aided and facilitated by enabling laws and institutions. Self-reliance is the key objective of life. An independent life requires a free and questioning mindset that takes nothing for granted and constantly challenges conventional wisdom. Children are encouraged to push the frontiers of knowledge by self-examination and open-minded enquiry. It is only a sceptical and dissenting mind that often thinks out of the box to explore new vistas of knowledge.
Collectivism promotes conformism and deference to authority whether it is parents, elders, teachers or the government. It is heresy to question established values and customs.
We pass on our passivity and uncritical attitudes to our children. No wonder, the educational system encourages rote learning and unquestioning acceptance of what is taught in the classrooms and stated in the textbooks. How can we expect our children to suddenly develop an enquiring and inquisitive attitude when they have been brought up in a milieu that discourages ‘disruptive' thoughts?
India and China were once advanced nations before foreign rule drained their resources and sapped their willpower and scientific traditions. Cultures tend to become conservative and defensive when subjected to long spells of colonial exploitation.
Indians are great believers in destiny. But our tradition does not frown upon free will and individual excellence. We must realise that our ability for free action remains unhampered despite what destiny may hold in store for us.
Fear of failure
Another flaw in our culture that prevents individual excellence is the fear of failure. The stigma associated with failure makes our children risk-averse while choosing their courses and careers.
Scientific research is a long-drawn war on received wisdom that requires many battles before it can be won. Science was not built in a day. Some of the battles can end in defeat. In the West, they celebrate failure as a stepping stone to success.
Educational reforms must be preceded by mental deconditioning of parents, teachers, educationists and policymakers — throwing away the cobwebs of uncritical submissiveness to conventional knowledge. Let us bring up a generation that will not hesitate to ask inconvenient questions. This generation will be the torch-bearer of a scientific revolution that will unleash cutting-edge research to make the Nobel Prize committee sit up and take notice....
http://www.thehindu.com/opinion/open-page/article2704625.ece
What is clear from the PISA results is that the Chinese students topped the list of 74 nations and Indian students ended up second to last at #73.
One chinese city(not a province) took part.
vs two Indian states....not a fair comparison.
Riaz
I would take this as a compliment that Indians are in a position to sell themselves for service in-spite of them not being up to the mark by the so called survey done by Australia.
Further in practical terms the west does not want to recruit much or outsource much from a place where it is perceived to be fomenting the Islamic fundamentalism against west. In fact now a days even the gcc is selective in getting people inside the country as they don't want either the virus of democracy or Islamic fundamentalism in the backyard.
It does not matter till such time services are sold and there is enough market. Probably Pakistan can look at what it can do to cut in the pie would be more a positive approach.
Here's an excerpt from a Bloomberg piece written by Pankaj Mishra:
In the 1990s, the drive (Delhi-Simla) would take eight hours. In 2009, it took about 11, and this autumn it took almost 12. Stretches of the road, especially those near small cities, resembled four- lane highways anywhere in the world. Elsewhere, passing through roadside settlements, the road shrank to a single lane; and here the queues built up, the air grew thick with dust and exhaust, and road rage erupted out of even the air-conditioned vehicles.
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The metaphor of highways has been deployed frequently to describe India’s potential, most famously by Thomas Friedman, who claimed in 2005 that India “is like a highway full of potholes,” but “off in the distance, the road seems to smooth out, and if it does, this country will be a dynamo.”
Like many other popular metaphors about India -- tiger, elephant, cellphone -- this one isn’t wholly mistaken. Indian highways rank highly among the infrastructure projects crucial to sustaining the country’s rapid economic growth (INQGGDPY), which is threatened by inflation, declining industrial production, a weakening currency (the rupee has dropped about 15 percent against the dollar this year) and corruption scandals that implicate some of India’s most well-known politicians and businessmen.
The question that Friedman asked in 2005 has grown more urgent: “Is that smoother road in the distance a mirage or the real thing?” Or, to put it differently: Did the perennial gap between illusion and reality somehow widen imperceptibly in the New India?
Education Racket
The answer to this question seemed obvious on the half- built highway to Delhi. The most conspicuous sights along the roadside were the placards for shiny new private educational institutions. They seem -- if you have never been inside one or met any of their alumni and looked only at the (misspelled) signboards promising professional success -- to be hectically preparing the basis for India’s “demographic dividend”: an overwhelmingly youthful population (WPOPINDI) that will soon become producers and consumers in the global economy.
In actuality, while most state-funded schools and colleges are barely functional, private education in India is largely a money-making racket. In September this year, a study of schools in the biggest states discovered that India’s peers in adult literacy are Afghanistan and Papua New Guinea.
Hundreds of millions of poorly educated and unemployable youth increasingly find themselves drawn to some peculiar forms of entrepreneurship. Twice on the highway from Shimla to Delhi, we were flagged down by groups of young men collecting “taxes.”
I have often come across these soft forms of banditry on the country roads of Uttar Pradesh and Bihar, two of India’s poorest and most populous states. The only difference here was that the young men seemed better educated, more resourceful and authoritative. One of the groups that stopped us near the Indian capital, less than a mile from an authentic police checkpoint, even had a jeep with the words “Delhi Municipal Toll” painted on the windshield.
Bleak employment prospects and a general social breakdown - - of morality no less than law and order -- were pushing them into a career of crime. Their brazen modus operandi in one of the country’s richest regions hinted that India’s “demographic dividend” was more likely to boost crime rather than gross domestic product.
For most of the previous decade, many Indians have been spellbound by a vision of imminent national greatness, oblivious to the basic fact that no country without a substantial manufacturing base and skilled workforce has ever become an economic superpower.....
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-12-30/on-road-to-delhi-india-s-economy-gets-real-commentary-by-pankaj-mishra.html
Here's a Financial Times Report on the inadequacy of India's primary education:
Primary education standards in India are as bad as in Papua New Guinea and crisis-torn Afghanistan and Yemen, according to a team of Indian development economists.
In a study of schools in the country’s most populous states they found that fast-paced economic growth has failed to improve India’s basic educational standards over the past 15 years. The Public Report on Basic Education Revisited showed some children were unable to read after three years of schooling across the Hindi-speaking northern belt.
“When the investigators arrived, half of the government schools were still devoid of any teaching activity,” the report said. “In a functioning democracy, this would be a major national concern. Yet little notice has been taken in the corridors of power.”
According to Jean Drèze, one of the report’s researchers and a prominent Indian policymaker, India now finds itself in an adult-literacy peer group that includes Afghanistan, Papua New Guinea and Yemen.
The ratio of students to teachers in Indian primary schools was three times higher than in China, with a typical class in Bihar, one of the poorest states, having as many as 92 pupils.
“After 20 years of meteoric economic growth, there’s been so little improvement in terms of the living standards of the people,” Mr Drèze said. “There’s a very serious crisis. We have to wake up to the fact that we are relying too heavily on economic growth.”
There are 5.5m teachers in India, but at least 1.2m more are required. “The reason there aren’t any teachers in school is because states have not recruited them for many years,” said Kapil Sibal, minister of Human Resources Development.
The report’s authors said that it had taken years to analyse and verify data collected in states such as Rajasthan, Madhya Pradesh, Uttar Pradesh and Bihar. One team member, A.K. Shiva Kumar, said that he and his colleagues had also reviewed educational data for the 2009-2010 year and found them to be “identical” to those of 2006.
The UN Development Programme’s Human Development Report for 2010 said Indians received just 4.4 years of schooling on average, compared with 7.5 years for China’s citizens. Sri Lanka outscores both with 8.2 years of schooling and is on par with China’s 99 per cent literacy rate for young female adults.
“Most developing countries are talking of [offering their children] 10 years of schooling,” said Mr Kumar, who is also a development economist and advises Unicef, the UN’s child welfare agency. “Here there’s lots of focus on growth rates but we are not looking at how India gets to 10 years of schooling.”
Meera Samson, a researcher at the Delhi-based Collaborative Research and Dissemination and report co-author, said head teachers had not been appointed at 20 per cent of the schools surveyed. At another 12 per cent of schools, only one teacher had been offered a position.
Last year, India’s parliament passed legislation requiring the state to provide universal education.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/3b2c9da2-cf01-11e0-86c5-00144feabdc0.html#axzz1i06MWVHc
In other words, only a little over one in six students in Tamil Nadu and nearly one in 10 students in Himachal Pradesh are performing at the OECD average. A similar trend was observed in mathematical and scientific literacy, too.
on average 1/8*1200=150 million Indians are performing at first world levels.
It gets even more interesting @ top 5% here it is at par with Norway and outperforms all other developing countries outside China.
"Even the whole BRIC hype about India is fading with Goldman Sachs' Jim O'Neill expressing disappointment with India."
Not as fast as the economy of western countries, deep in debt and almost bankrupt. UK, Italy, Spain and even USA. It is amusing how you ignore that and harp on India.
Anon: "Not as fast as the economy of western countries, deep in debt and almost bankrupt. UK, Italy, Spain and even USA."
Well, the West going down is just more bad news for India, given India's heavy reliance on foreign capital inflows from US and Europe that sustain its economy.
Without such capital inflows (FII+FDI+NRI remittances), India could have a serious balance of payments crisis that Jim O'Neill of Goldman Sachs has warned about.
Anon: "on average 1/8*1200=150 million Indians are performing at first world levels."
1.2 billion is the population of India, not the number of Indian children attending school.
Millions of Indians, particularly in the Hindi belt, are out of school. A recent Indian report compared the quality of primary education in these populous northern states of UP and Bihar with that in Afghanistan and Papua New Guinea.
Adult literacy in India is among the lowest in the world. There are 270 million illiterate adults in India, the largest in the world, according to UNESCO.
"Well, the West going down is just more bad news for India, given India's heavy reliance on foreign capital inflows from US and Europe that sustain its economy."
But that does not answer my question. Why don't you talk about bankrupt US economy and other European countries.
Here's Meeta Senguota's blog post on PISA results in Times of India:
Our pedagogies and entire school systems are designed to feed a specific type of learning- generically known as learning by rote. We teach and learn for the assessment. And assessments, if they are to be standardized and defensible are often merely linear tests of information, not knowledge.
The traditional education system is often berated for belonging to the industrial age - where a standard product needs to be created, using standardized processes, where products move along an assembly line, from one level of preparedness to the next. Till finally, the product is ready for the job market. This is clearly a utilitarian view of education, where we need to feed the machinery of the present with efficiency, and for efficiency.
The meaning of the word learning has been debated and measured in literature largely via assessments. And yet, the purpose of education is often stated in more lofty terms - growth, progress, development; thought and society among others. Yet, our assessments do not reflect the stated purpose of education. While we practice and acknowledge that our teaching is geared to our assessments, and we also measure individual and systemic success via the same assessments, it becomes incumbent on us to focus our efforts on designing those assessments well.
Learning for each of us means different things. For some it means proficiency in the classic 3 R's - reading, writing and arithmetic. For others it is reflected in the ability to pass exams, or, in the number and range of competitions won. for some, it is the ability to carry an argument forward, to a cohesive end that demonstrates learning, while for people like me, it is clearly the ability to make good decisions that signifies that good learning has taken place. For some, learning is about good values- both at work and as a human being.
http://blogs.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/educable/entry/the-race-to-better-learning
In a 2008 assessment, Indian students ranked second to last among seven emerging economies, as reported by Siliconindia:
Bangalore: The draught of education in India has reached the extreme as it ranks sixth among the seven emerging economies of the world, in terms of education quality. The country has scored only 3.3 points in the study, in terms of primary, secondary, tertiary and demographic parameters, while Russia topped the chart with 7.3 points.
As per the Assocham study, India was at the last position in terms of quality of secondary education while Russia and Brazil had maximum scores. The quality of tertiary education in India was lowest among the other emerging nations. The points it scored on the scale of 2, was 0.1. Even though the demographics of India are considered its strength, the country has scored the minimum in this too and was ranked at last place. Moreover, in terms of students enrollment for primary education, India is highly incompetitive with the gross enrollment ratio standing at 98.1.
"Serious attention needs to be paid towards the education system. India may stand to loose its competitive advantages against the other countries in long term if corrective measures are not taken to strengthen the Indian education system qualitatively," said Sajjan Jindal, ASSOCHAM President while releasing the ASSOCHAM Eco Pulse (AEP) Study 'Comparative Study of Emerging Economies on Quality of Education'. It was carried out on the basis of 20 parameters relating to primary, secondary, tertiary education and higher education and demography and data provided by UNESCO, IMF, WEF, Financial Times was used for the purpose.
Among the rest five countries, China has secured second place with scoring 6.7 points, while Brazil has positioned itself at third place with 5.56 score points as the quality of education in Brazil remains stable across all levels of primary, secondary and higher education. Mexico has been ranked at fourth place on the strength of its higher education. South Africa, a relatively new entrant to the club of developing economies, has managed to be on fifth place on the strength of its tertiary education and demographic qualities though it lags far behind in primary education. However, Indonesia stands at the last position with an overall score of 2.68 points. The gross enrolment ratio is highest in Brazil (148.5), followed by China (116.2) and Russia (113.8). Even Indonesia (110.9) and South Africa (105.1) enjoy better enrolment ratio than India.
However, only in terms of teacher-student ratio the country outsmarts all as in India for every forty students, there is one teacher.
http://www.siliconindia.com/shownews/India_ranks_second_last_in_Quality_Education-nid-50034-cid-Others.html
Here's a review of "Back to Pakistan: A 50 Years Journey" by Leslie Noyes Mass, a US Peace Corp volunteer:
Mass discovered a significantly different country: more education for young children, an exploding population, and a country not nearly as friendly to the United States as it was when she was there years ago. I wouldn’t call any of these changes a great surprise, yet I found Back to Pakistan totally engaging for the contrasts I have already mentioned—plus the mirroring of some of the experiences I encountered as a volunteer in Nigeria.
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Shift to 2009. Mass returns to Pakistan with several others, including people who were in the Peace Corps all those years ago. She’s been teaching for decades, earned a doctorate in early and middle school education, and retired from her job as director of an educational program at Ohio Wesleyan University. She’s a pro, accustomed to training teachers, which she and her friends will do in Pakistan for several months. They have been successful with making arrangements with The Citizens Foundation (TCF), a private organization that has set up several hundred schools across the country since the government-sponsored schools are sadly lacking. TCF has had major successes in the country, largely because of its curriculum and the dedication of its teachers who are women only.
Mass, thus, in 2009 is part volunteer, part educational expert, part tourist, keenly attuned to all the differences in the country from the first time she worked there. The activities with TCF are totally professional, and instantly rewarding. But it is an incident related to her by Ateed Riaz, one of the organization’s founding directors, that is most revealing to Mass (and to this reader), providing the context for the country’s education and development: “A friend of mine went to the city of Medina and went to a woman squatting on the floor selling something. He negotiated with her, but she would not sell to him. She said, ‘If you like it, buy it from that other tradeswoman. I will not sell it to you.’ So he got a local to come and talk to her in her own language. She talked to the local and explained that she had already sold enough that day and that other woman had not yet sold any, so I should buy from her. The message is clear: We need to help each other."
http://www.counterpunch.org/2011/12/30/pakistan-fifty-years-later/
riaz
there is no use in making all indian international standard as every country limits the expat. who are not in a position to go to their international standard will be a resource for the local business after it all requires human capital.
Atleast in india corporate and people are concern about the education and it is moving slow in the correct direction, but it is not so in case of bangladesh or pakistan.
So How can Pakistan help India in Education ? Pakistan has got atleast some responsibility to help their backward neighbours.
Malik: "So How can Pakistan help India in Education ?"
By helping itself first in overcoming its own education deficits.
Perception of Indians in USA is that Indian Americans are smart, yet we have NEVER been shown ANY hard evidence on what is the average IQ of these so called "smart" Indians in America. Evidences such as average IQ, or at least SAT scores with Indians ONLY, not mixed together with other high achieving East Asians under a ridiculous concept of "Asian" category.
Perhaps the inconvenient fact is that Indians are not smart, and genetic variations alone amongst 1.2 billion of them have logically made some smart ones who have by and large flocked into North America under H1B.
As for India itself, unlike what mainstream liberal media prefer, India is recognized as a failed state in Asia, a pit that no one, not even Indians, want to live in (except some occasional western tree-hugging pop & Hollywood stars such as lady Gaga and Tom Cruise? ) - a pretty strong evidence of what is India's average IQ.
"Perception of Indians in USA is that Indian Americans are smart, yet we have NEVER been shown ANY hard evidence on what is the average IQ of these so called "smart" Indians in America. Evidences such as average IQ, or at least SAT scores with Indians ONLY, not mixed together with other high achieving East Asians under a ridiculous concept of "Asian" category."
Attempt to collect any such evidences would be deemed as racist. In UK several years ago it was published that second/third generationIndians do much better than their Pakistanis counterpart. What do you think was the reaction of Pakistani Britishers?
Having said it, I do agree with it is ridiculous to suggest that Indians are smart based on tiny percentage of IIT going very smart people. And while we are at it, the same can be said about Americans too, based on my personal experience of working here for nearly two decades.
Anon: "In UK several years ago it was published that second/third generationIndians do much better than their Pakistanis counterpart."
The demographics of British Pakistanis are well understood---about two-thirds are originally rural peasant folks from Mirpur district in Azad Kashmir who were displaced when Mangla dam was built in Pakistan in the 1960s. Most took the cpmpensation money and used it to buy tickets to the UK and settled there.
The children of the early Mirpuri migrants from Pakistani Kashmir in the UK have done fairly well given their humble beginnings, but they are certainly not representative of Pakistan's educated urban middle class, many of whom go to the US and other destinations primarily for higher education and then settle there.
@anon
>>India is recognized as a failed state in Asia, a pit that no one, not even Indians, want to live in (except some occasional western tree-hugging pop & Hollywood stars such as lady Gaga and Tom Cruise? ) - a pretty strong evidence of what is India's average IQ.
For the last well known 6,000 years of Indian History, in the last 250 years, we look like we dont have much (everage)IQ.
Not comprehensive, just few examples..
Try comparing the IQ of the rest of the world and Indians during the advanced urban civilizations of Mohenjo-daro and Harappa..
Try comparing the IQ of the rest of the world and Indians when India under the Mauryan empire....
In this unipolar world not even the USA match what was Aurangzeb's
India. Then, compare the IQ of Indians and the rest of the world..
Nobody ever heard of any scientist or mathematician in europe before des cartes... Where did all the pre-calculus mathematics came from ?
Around mid seventeen hundreads, we made a mistake. A grave mistake. We paid its price. But we are the sons of our fathers. WE WILL REBUILD IT AGAIN TO A LEVEL THAT NOBODY EVEN DARE TO COMPARE ANYTHING AGANIST THE SONS OF THE MIGHTY INDUS, GANGA AND SARASWATHY.
As you can see, we have started it. Thats.... I agree, its not perfect. But seems like its kind of OK !
"Perception of Indians in USA is that Indian Americans are smart, yet we have NEVER been shown ANY hard evidence on what is the average IQ of these so called "smart" Indians in America. Evidences such as average IQ, or at least SAT scores with Indians ONLY, not mixed together with other high achieving East Asians under a ridiculous concept of "Asian" category."
It is curious to see how you getting angry about Indians making false claims about superior IQ, but are quick to point out the same to east asians. For all its worth, China until 1990 had a lower per capita income than Pakistan and in 1960 South Korea PCI was less than Pakistan.
Indeed success in life is no direct co-relation with IQ. Do you think every American has higher IQ just because the std of living here is higher.
read the following about Phds in USA.
http://www.demos.co.uk/files/File/atlas_CongCao.pdf
You mean like this:-
http://www.financialexpress.com/news/intel-set-to-leverage-india-unit-for-r&d-in-tablets-phones/887172/0
Afzal: "You mean like this:-.."
I bet these PISA test results are ringing alarm bells for those in India hoping the reality of poverty of education in India remains hidden from the likes of Intel who may be hoping to find cheap India replacements for expensive American engineers as part of cost arbitrage.
But sooner or later Intel and others are going to find out the reality, as the Indian cream of crop like IIT grads get hired and the rest of the work-force from second and third-tier schools turns out to be duds.
Some, like GE, are already bringing some manufacturing jobs back to America.
Here's the link to DAWN that talks about Agha Khan University survey:
http://www.dawn.com/2011/11/23/most-teachers-give-15-minutes-in-class-study.html
Thank you for all of your Blog posts (especially related to education).
Here are some excerpts from a piece by Lan Pritchett of Harvard University on India's poor performance on PISA:
Compared to the economic superstars India is almost unfathomably far behind. The TN/HP average 15 year old is over 200 points behind. If a typical grade gain is 40 points a year Indian eighth graders are at the level of Korea third graders in their mathematics mastery. In fact the average TN/HP child is 40 to 50 points behind the worst students in the economic superstars. Equally worrisome is that the best performers in TN/HP - the top 5 percent who India will need in science and technology to complete globally - were almost 100 points behind the average child in Singapore and 83 points behind the average Korean - and a staggering 250 points behind the best in the best.
As the current superpowers are behind the East Asian economic superstars in learning performance the distance to India is not quite as far, but still the average TN/HP child is right at the level of the worst OECD or American students (only 1.5 or 7.5 points ahead). Indians often deride America's schools but the average child placed in an American school would be among the weakest students. Indians might have believed, with President Obama, that American schools were under threat from India but the best TN/HP students are 24 points behind the average American 15 year old.
Even among other "developing" nations that make up the BRICs India lags - from Russia by almost as much as the USA and only for Brazil, which like the rest of Latin America is infamous for lagging education performance does India even come close - and then not even that close.
To put these results in perspective, in the USA there has been huge and continuous concern that has caused seismic shifts in the discourse about education driven, in part, by the fact that the USA is lagging the economic superstars like Korea. But the average US 15 year old is 59 points behind Koreans. TN/HP students are 41.5 points behind Brazil, and twice as far behind Russia (123.5 points) as the US is Korea, and almost four times further behind Singapore (217.5 vs 59) that the US is behind Korea. Yet so far this disastrous performance has yet to occasion a ripple in the education establishment.
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These PISA 2009+ results are the end of the beginning. The debate is over. No one can still deny there is a deep crisis in the ability of the existing education system to produce child learning. India's education system is undermining India's legitimate aspirations to be at the global forefront as a prosperous economy, as a global great power, as an emulated polity, and as a fair and just society. As the beginning ends, the question now is: what is to be done?
http://ajayshahblog.blogspot.com/2012/01/first-pisa-results-for-india-end-of.html
Here's an uplifting story in Express Tribune about a Pakistani with 28 A's in O Level exams:
Prime Minister Yousaf Raza Gilani has presented a cheque of Rs1 million as a token of appreciation to a student from Taxila who had set a world record in the O-level examinations.
Zohaib Asad, a student of Beaconhouse, earned 28 As in the University of Cambridge International O-Level Examinations in 2011. He overtook a record of 23 As, also set by a Pakistani student from Islamabad Ibrahim Shahid.
Gilani invited Asad to the Prime Minister House on Thursday and lauded him for making Pakistan’s youth proud. He said that Asad’s achievement will inspire other young students to excel in life through sheer hard work.
Asad is currently enrolled at McGill University in Montreal, Canada, where he is pursuing an undergraduate degree in economics and international development.
Speaking to the prime minister, he said that he was determined to return to Pakistan after completion of his education to serve the country that has given so much in life at an early age.
Gilani appreciated Asad’s sense of devotion to the country the country and said that young people like him were Pakistan’s hope for a brighter future.
Asad’s family members were also present in the meeting.
http://tribune.com.pk/story/317004/pm-honours-student-who-set-o-level-world-record/
Here's a story published in Fast Company about an "Education Revolution" in Pakistan:
TED Fellow, social entrepreneur and filmmaker Sharmeen Obaid-Chinoy is on a mission to foment Pakistan's education revolution.
The province of Sindh, where Obaid-Chinoy is based, decided less than two months ago to completely revamp public school textbooks, and the government enlisted Obaid-Chinoy to help. "There needs to be an overhaul," Obaid-Chinoy tells Fast Company. "Textbooks are outdated and I've been working with the government on how to encourage critical thinking and move away from rote memorization....It's tough, because the mindset is not there. The teachers are essentially products of the same system. We have to break the culture, which takes a long time."
Sindh's teachers now spend extensive time in professional training with education experts to try and reform the instruction of English, math, and social studies. "We're really making this a movement for education for social change," Obaid-Chinoy says.
"People are excited by it. Everyone's getting into it, rolling up their sleeves. We're trying to bridge the divide between the public and private school systems," which, she says, is at the heart of Pakistan's education challenges. The poorer schools are under-resourced and are often recruiting grounds for young terrorists. By improving the public education system, the less-fortunate children have a better shot at a solid future, away from terrorist groups, and local leaders hope to accomplish improvements by focusing on textbooks and teacher trainings.
"Pakistan also feels it needs to catch up with the rest of the world in terms of education and that was the genesis for the education overhaul," says Obaid-Chinoy. "Terrorism defines us today," but, she says, there was a time when the country was known for its vibrancy and sense of hope.
Obaid-Chinoy is doing her part in other ways to revamp Pakistan's education system. In 2007 she started CitizensArchive.org, the country's first digital archive documenting its oral history with interviews, rare photos, and other online collections. The initiative allows students in schools throughout Pakistan, Bangladesh, and India to better understand Pakistan and its history and Obaid-Chinoy was able to interview several notable figures who have since passed away, such as Deena Mistri, one of the country's first female educators. And students around South Asia are now engaged in learning exchanges with students in Pakistan, to help the countries build bridges.
And throughout her education work, Obaid-Chinoy's medium is often filmmaking. She makes about one film per year and has covered a range of topics from jihadi schools to female victims of acid attacks. Her next film will look at 9/11 through the eyes of different figures, in commemoration of the 10th anniversary this year.
"My mother gave up her dream of becoming a journalist when she got married and I think she always wanted to make sure that her six children pursued their dreams. I have four sisters and all of us work in male-dominated professions in Pakistan." And Obaid-Chinoy now brings that same sense of passion and justice to her work and thanks to her, her country may soon become a bright spot for global-minded education.
http://www.fastcompany.com/1731268/pakistan-education-revolution
Here's a private-public partnership initiative for education in Sindh, as reported in The Express Tribune:
The Sindh Education Foundation has handed over the management of 1,200 schools across Sindh to entrepreneurs under its private-public partnership programme, Integrated Education Learning Programme (IELP).
The SEF asked entrepreneurs to apply for school adoption by submitting proposals and they received a staggering 9,600 applications. Each proposal was strictly assessed. There should be no other primary school within a one-kilometre radius of the new one or already established school as this would affect enrolment. No other secondary school should exist within a two-kilometre radius. At least 40 children should be enrolled in primary schools and 30 in elementary and secondary classes. The programme requires the student-teacher ratio to be at least 1:4. Teachers should be paid a minimum of Rs5,000 while at least Rs2,500 should be paid to the support staff. Drinking water and clean toilets are other prerequisites for the IELP selection.
Out of the total applications received, 4,500 were initially shortlisted and 1,500 were finally randomly selected, informed Sadaf Junaid Zuberi, the SEF senior manager.
The final contract signing ceremony was held at the SEF headquarters on Monday where the remaining 300 of the 1,500 selected entrepreneurs sealed their school adoption deal in the presence of Senior Minister for Education and Literacy Pir Mazharul Haq.
Prof Anita Ghulam Ali, the SEF managing director, welcomed the guests and school entrepreneurs and called for operators to take up this opportunity with full honesty and commitment. “You can change the future of thousands of children,” she said.
Lauding the efforts of the SEF, the education minister said that it has been promoting lasting public-private partnerships in the education sector. The government plans to open more schools under this agreement and people who adopt them will be strictly monitored.
The programme was launched in 2009 and was designed to give financial and technical support to new and existing private, community and trust-owned schools throughout the province. Three hundred schools were already working successfully. The project directly reaches 450,000 children.
Each entrepreneur will get a 350-rupee subsidy per child from the Sindh government via the SEF. They will be responsible for the school’s management, monitoring, enrolment, building capacity, community and parent mobilisation and student assessment.
As the project is fully funded IELP students do not pay any fees. SEF will provide textbooks and classroom aides and will also work on teacher training.
IELP follows the SEF’s Promoting Private Schooling in Rural Sindh (PPRS) programme. It is different from the PPRS as it involves both primary and secondary schools.
SEF director of programmes, operations and research, Aziz Kabani, said the aim was to “establish public-private partnership to increase access to and improve the quality of educational services to children in marginalised areas of the province”.
http://tribune.com.pk/story/156552/entrepreneurs-adopt-1200-more-schools-in-sindh/
Pakistan student is math champion reports Today's Zaman:
Usama Mahmoud Hawar, a student at a Turkish school in Pakistan, has become the world champion in mathematics in an exam commissioned by the British Council’s Cambridge University, the Anatolia news agency reported on Sunday.
Hawar, one of 12 million students from 200 countries to participate in the exam, was a final-year student at Lahore High School for Boys, one of the Turkish schools operating in Pakistan. The math world champion received a great deal of attention from the Pakistani media, which congratulated the successful students, teachers and schools of the exam.
Hawar told Anatolia that he owes his success to his school, math teacher and hard work. The school principal, Adem Akgedik, in comments to Anatolia, said the largest factor in Hawar’s success goes to his math teacher, Mehmet Zengin, who would work with his student for many hours after the school day was over.
After completing high school, Hawar said he wants to study economics at a university in Turkey.
A total of 6,000 Pakistani students are receiving an education from the 22 internationally acclaimed Turkish schools operating in Pakistan.
http://www.todayszaman.com/news-268017-turkish-school-in--pakistan-produces-math-world-champion.html
In a recent speech President Obama exaggerated the competitive threat from India and China. He said,"when global firms were asked a few years back where they planned on building new research and development facilities, nearly 80 per cent said either China or India – because those countries are focused on math and science, and they're focused on training and educating their workforce".
Based on the recent PISA test results, Obama may be right about threat from China. But India? I don't agree.
Here's why:
The average Indian child taking part in PISA2009+ is 40 to 50 points behind the worst students in the economic superstars. Even the best performers in Tamil Nadu and Himachal Pradesh - the top 5 percent who India will need in science and technology to complete globally - were almost 100 points behind the average child in Singapore and 83 points behind the average Korean - and a staggering 250 points behind the best in the best.
The average child in HP & TN is right at the level of the worst OECD or American students (only 1.5 or 7.5 points ahead). Contrary to President Obama's oft-expressed concerns about American students ability to compete with their Indian counterparts, the average 15-year-old Indian placed in an American school would be among the weakest students in the classroom. Even the best TN/HP students are 24 points behind the average American 15 year old.
http://www.riazhaq.com/2011/12/pisa-timss-confirm-low-quality-of.html
"Based on the recent PISA test results, Obama may be right about threat from China. But India? I don't agree."
I agree about India with you.
"Based on the recent PISA test results, Obama may be right about threat from China. But India? I don't agree."
I agree about India with you."
How can you compare a survey on one city Shanghai with 80 million combined population of Two large states of India I.E Tamil Nadu and Himachal Pradesh, if you want to compare such survey then the City Shanghai data must be compared with cites of India such us Chennai, Delhi, Mumbai or any major metro cities data...I believe any other country from South Asia would be faring badley then HP and TN states of India if state wise test is conducted...
RK Pillai
PK: "How can you compare a survey on one city Shanghai with 80 million combined population of Two large states of India I.E Tamil Nadu and Himachal Pradesh,..."
Look at the sample sizes in Table A.4 of ACER PISA results announcement:
Tamil Nadu: 3210
Himachal Pradesh: 1616
These are smaller than Shanghai's 5000 students tested for PISA2009.
https://mypisa.acer.edu.au/images/mypisadoc/acer_pisa%202009%2B%20international.pdf
And look at the huge gap...China at top vs India at bottom among 74 nations tested by PISA2009.
Please check the results of the past International Maths Olympiad or the physics Olympiad and see where your counrty stands....did not find any article from you critical of you own county's extremely poor performance in these tests...
Regards
Shahid: "Please check the results of the past International Maths Olympiad or the physics Olympiad and see where your counrty stands."
Here's some recent news on Pakistani students' participation at Olympiads:
Young Pakistani scholars brought laurels to the country by achieving top honours in International Olympiads of Biology, Physics, Chemistry and Mathematics held in different parts of the world.
All four members of the Pakistani team won bronze medals in International Biology Olympiad held in Taiwan from July 10-17, 2011. Two students won bronze medals and two honourable mentions in International Physics Olympiad hosted by Thailand from July 10-18, 2011. Two of the four Pakistani teams won bronze medals while one of them clinched honourable mention in International Chemistry Olympiad held in Turkey from July 10-18, 2011. In the International Mathematics Olympiad held from July 16-24, 2011 in the Netherlands, one student won bronze medal and one honourable mention.
http://www.thenews.com.pk/TodaysPrintDetail.aspx?ID=73208&Cat=6
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